Comments on: MTA, eyeing 2010 hike, blames the machines for the 2008 raise http://secondavenuesagas.com/2007/09/27/mta-eyeing-2010-hike-blames-the-machines-for-the-2008-raise/ A New York City Subway Blog Sun, 27 Jul 2008 08:11:12 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6 By: Tom Pick http://secondavenuesagas.com/2007/09/27/mta-eyeing-2010-hike-blames-the-machines-for-the-2008-raise/#comment-3039 Tom Pick Fri, 09 Nov 2007 16:58:53 +0000 http://secondavenuesagas.com/2007/09/27/mta-eyeing-2010-hike-blames-the-machines-for-the-2008-raise/#comment-3039 Smart Cards would definitely solve the problem - they could make the fare $2.16987 if they wanted, and the vending machines wouldn't matter. Part of the reason for the slowness of adoption is that smart cards have been expensive to produce. Costs are coming down now due to several recent technology developments. One that caught my eye was an announcement by Aveso of its new Primero flexible display technology. This lets card makers embed flexible displays onto cards using existing production machinery, which should make the cards much easier and cheaper to produce. It will also improve security for things like online banking and e-commerce transactions. Smart Cards would definitely solve the problem - they could make the fare $2.16987 if they wanted, and the vending machines wouldn’t matter.

Part of the reason for the slowness of adoption is that smart cards have been expensive to produce. Costs are coming down now due to several recent technology developments. One that caught my eye was an announcement by Aveso of its new Primero flexible display technology. This lets card makers embed flexible displays onto cards using existing production machinery, which should make the cards much easier and cheaper to produce. It will also improve security for things like online banking and e-commerce transactions.

]]> By: Killuminati http://secondavenuesagas.com/2007/09/27/mta-eyeing-2010-hike-blames-the-machines-for-the-2008-raise/#comment-2068 Killuminati Fri, 26 Oct 2007 03:57:59 +0000 http://secondavenuesagas.com/2007/09/27/mta-eyeing-2010-hike-blames-the-machines-for-the-2008-raise/#comment-2068 Fcuk the mta!!!!! they could suk my dik, bastids, yet another attack on the middle class........ Fcuk the mta!!!!! they could suk my dik, bastids, yet another attack on the middle class……..

]]> By: MTA Discriminates Against Dimes : SUBWAYblogger.com: Blog from the New York City Subway | Transit | MTA | News http://secondavenuesagas.com/2007/09/27/mta-eyeing-2010-hike-blames-the-machines-for-the-2008-raise/#comment-1462 MTA Discriminates Against Dimes : SUBWAYblogger.com: Blog from the New York City Subway | Transit | MTA | News Sat, 29 Sep 2007 03:16:18 +0000 http://secondavenuesagas.com/2007/09/27/mta-eyeing-2010-hike-blames-the-machines-for-the-2008-raise/#comment-1462 [...] What an outrage. Where’s Al Sharpton when you need him. Oh yeah…he’s busy trying to get himself on TV with the Jena 6. Anyway, we’ve recently learned that the MTA hates dimes. [...] [...] What an outrage. Where’s Al Sharpton when you need him. Oh yeah…he’s busy trying to get himself on TV with the Jena 6. Anyway, we’ve recently learned that the MTA hates dimes. [...]

]]> By: peter http://secondavenuesagas.com/2007/09/27/mta-eyeing-2010-hike-blames-the-machines-for-the-2008-raise/#comment-1463 peter Fri, 28 Sep 2007 12:49:15 +0000 http://secondavenuesagas.com/2007/09/27/mta-eyeing-2010-hike-blames-the-machines-for-the-2008-raise/#comment-1463 Yeah, they coulda designed a machine to take nickels & dimes, or even pennies, but it wouldve been a bigger more complicated even more expensive machine. Instedda spending around a billion bucks to design install and operate the complicated AFC csystem throughout NYCTA, a regional tax shouldve been instituted, and the subway made free. Of course, if wishes were horses (or trains), beggars would ride. Yeah, they coulda designed a machine to take nickels & dimes, or even pennies, but it wouldve been a bigger more complicated even more expensive machine.

Instedda spending around a billion bucks to design install and operate the complicated AFC csystem throughout NYCTA, a regional tax shouldve been instituted, and the subway made free. Of course, if wishes were horses (or trains), beggars would ride.

]]> By: MiKe Hansen http://secondavenuesagas.com/2007/09/27/mta-eyeing-2010-hike-blames-the-machines-for-the-2008-raise/#comment-1471 MiKe Hansen Fri, 28 Sep 2007 01:18:22 +0000 http://secondavenuesagas.com/2007/09/27/mta-eyeing-2010-hike-blames-the-machines-for-the-2008-raise/#comment-1471 I agree with Marc. The last time the fares went up less than a quarter it was an increase of about 10%. A quarter increase now is just about 10% The problem is that a quarter does not go very far as it did in tha past I agree with Marc.
The last time the fares went up less than a quarter it was an increase of about 10%. A quarter increase now is just about 10% The problem is that a quarter does not go very far as it did in tha past

]]> By: Your Tax Money Hard At Work at MyQaeda Celebrity Fashion Blog http://secondavenuesagas.com/2007/09/27/mta-eyeing-2010-hike-blames-the-machines-for-the-2008-raise/#comment-1470 Your Tax Money Hard At Work at MyQaeda Celebrity Fashion Blog Thu, 27 Sep 2007 17:35:30 +0000 http://secondavenuesagas.com/2007/09/27/mta-eyeing-2010-hike-blames-the-machines-for-the-2008-raise/#comment-1470 [...] [Daily News via Second Ave. Sagas] [...] [...] [Daily News via Second Ave. Sagas] [...]

]]> By: Benjamin Kabak http://secondavenuesagas.com/2007/09/27/mta-eyeing-2010-hike-blames-the-machines-for-the-2008-raise/#comment-1469 Benjamin Kabak Thu, 27 Sep 2007 17:27:28 +0000 http://secondavenuesagas.com/2007/09/27/mta-eyeing-2010-hike-blames-the-machines-for-the-2008-raise/#comment-1469 In that case, I wouldn't call new fare-collection machines a "solution." But as the MTA looks to replace them anyway (and possibly adapt SmartCard technology), the Authority should ensure that the new machines can handle fare increments of varying degrees. In that case, I wouldn’t call new fare-collection machines a “solution.” But as the MTA looks to replace them anyway (and possibly adapt SmartCard technology), the Authority should ensure that the new machines can handle fare increments of varying degrees.

]]> By: Marc Shepherd http://secondavenuesagas.com/2007/09/27/mta-eyeing-2010-hike-blames-the-machines-for-the-2008-raise/#comment-1468 Marc Shepherd Thu, 27 Sep 2007 17:26:01 +0000 http://secondavenuesagas.com/2007/09/27/mta-eyeing-2010-hike-blames-the-machines-for-the-2008-raise/#comment-1468 Ben, the capabilities of the hardware are very much a part of the economics. If the machines that you have work in multiples of $0.25, how can that <I>not</I> be part of the equation? The machines are what they are. The issue is a red herring. Hardly anyone pays the base fare anyway. And there are many other levers can be adjusted to get the revenue to whatever level they need: bridge & tunnel tolls, LIRR and MNRR fares, MetroCard discounts, unlimited ride discounts, and so forth. It really is silly to suggest rolling out new fare-collection machines as a "solution," when the fare is probably going up again in a couple of years anyway. Yes, I do realize that the fares used to go up in smaller increments. (I looked at the same Wikipedia article before posting.) The point is that they have not done so in a very long time. Ben, the capabilities of the hardware are very much a part of the economics. If the machines that you have work in multiples of $0.25, how can that not be part of the equation? The machines are what they are.

The issue is a red herring. Hardly anyone pays the base fare anyway. And there are many other levers can be adjusted to get the revenue to whatever level they need: bridge & tunnel tolls, LIRR and MNRR fares, MetroCard discounts, unlimited ride discounts, and so forth.

It really is silly to suggest rolling out new fare-collection machines as a “solution,” when the fare is probably going up again in a couple of years anyway.

Yes, I do realize that the fares used to go up in smaller increments. (I looked at the same Wikipedia article before posting.) The point is that they have not done so in a very long time.

]]> By: Benjamin Kabak http://secondavenuesagas.com/2007/09/27/mta-eyeing-2010-hike-blames-the-machines-for-the-2008-raise/#comment-1467 Benjamin Kabak Thu, 27 Sep 2007 16:54:27 +0000 http://secondavenuesagas.com/2007/09/27/mta-eyeing-2010-hike-blames-the-machines-for-the-2008-raise/#comment-1467 Silly, Marc? I would hope that the MTA would choose a fare based on the economics of the times and their financial situation and not on the demands of their vending machines or lack of any sort of foresight when ordering those machines. Looking back at the <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_City_transit_fares" rel="nofollow">history of transit fares</a>, recent history aside, rare are the days when the fare is a multiple of $0.25. The fact that the machines make this sort of flexibility tough is rather absurd, no? Silly, Marc? I would hope that the MTA would choose a fare based on the economics of the times and their financial situation and not on the demands of their vending machines or lack of any sort of foresight when ordering those machines.

Looking back at the history of transit fares, recent history aside, rare are the days when the fare is a multiple of $0.25. The fact that the machines make this sort of flexibility tough is rather absurd, no?

]]> By: Marc Shepherd http://secondavenuesagas.com/2007/09/27/mta-eyeing-2010-hike-blames-the-machines-for-the-2008-raise/#comment-1466 Marc Shepherd Thu, 27 Sep 2007 15:26:24 +0000 http://secondavenuesagas.com/2007/09/27/mta-eyeing-2010-hike-blames-the-machines-for-the-2008-raise/#comment-1466 This is a rather silly post. For the last 16 years, and for 27 of the last 32 years, the base subway fare has been a multiple of $0.25. It was, therefore, not surprising that the machines were designed to give change in twenty-five cent increments. Sounds pretty sensible to me. Even if the design was wrong, what do you want them to do about it <I>now?</I> It's not merely a programming issue. The machines would need a new physical capability that they currnetly do not have. Do you <I>really</I> want them to waste our money designing new machines that dole out nickels and dimes, when for the last 16 years we've never needed it? Yes, it may be that only 14% of riders pay in cash, but that's still a pretty significant percentage. And yes, the MTA is looking into replacing the current generation of machines, but that's several years away (at least), and no one thinks the fare can stay at $2.00 until that happens. This is a rather silly post.

For the last 16 years, and for 27 of the last 32 years, the base subway fare has been a multiple of $0.25. It was, therefore, not surprising that the machines were designed to give change in twenty-five cent increments. Sounds pretty sensible to me.

Even if the design was wrong, what do you want them to do about it now? It’s not merely a programming issue. The machines would need a new physical capability that they currnetly do not have. Do you really want them to waste our money designing new machines that dole out nickels and dimes, when for the last 16 years we’ve never needed it?

Yes, it may be that only 14% of riders pay in cash, but that’s still a pretty significant percentage. And yes, the MTA is looking into replacing the current generation of machines, but that’s several years away (at least), and no one thinks the fare can stay at $2.00 until that happens.

]]>