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	<title>Comments on: Delayed South Ferry opening a matter of inches</title>
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	<link>http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/01/28/delayed-south-ferry-opening-a-matter-of-inches/</link>
	<description>A New York City Subway Blog</description>
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		<title>By: South Ferry opening day still unknown :: Second Ave. Sagas &#124; A New York City Subway Blog</title>
		<link>http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/01/28/delayed-south-ferry-opening-a-matter-of-inches/#comment-59051</link>
		<dc:creator>South Ferry opening day still unknown :: Second Ave. Sagas &#124; A New York City Subway Blog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Mar 2009 17:31:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=2123#comment-59051</guid>
		<description>[...] construction problem rendered the station non-ADA compliant, it seemed as though the station would open at the end of February. Now that February has come and gone, the station remains in MTA construction [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] construction problem rendered the station non-ADA compliant, it seemed as though the station would open at the end of February. Now that February has come and gone, the station remains in MTA construction [...]</p>
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		<title>By: New South Ferry terminal not opening in the near future &#171; The Railfan Window Blog</title>
		<link>http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/01/28/delayed-south-ferry-opening-a-matter-of-inches/#comment-58925</link>
		<dc:creator>New South Ferry terminal not opening in the near future &#171; The Railfan Window Blog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 Feb 2009 14:28:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=2123#comment-58925</guid>
		<description>[...] though the platform width fix was only supposed to take three to four weeks, it looks like the new South Ferry subway terminal [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] though the platform width fix was only supposed to take three to four weeks, it looks like the new South Ferry subway terminal [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Niccolo Machiavelli</title>
		<link>http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/01/28/delayed-south-ferry-opening-a-matter-of-inches/#comment-58538</link>
		<dc:creator>Niccolo Machiavelli</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Jan 2009 04:23:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=2123#comment-58538</guid>
		<description>&quot;Those guys at MTA are just a bunch of dopes &quot;
and &quot;Was this gap screw up a contractor error, a design error or a combination of both?&quot;

Look at the picture, it is a curve.  The cars on the train make a chord, a different geometric concept.  There will always be a gap, fine tuning, precision movement, with real good modern equipment on that track layout you can hold it to three inches.  But Jesus &quot;bunch of dopes&quot;, over three weeks and $200,000?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Those guys at MTA are just a bunch of dopes &#8221;<br />
and &#8220;Was this gap screw up a contractor error, a design error or a combination of both?&#8221;</p>
<p>Look at the picture, it is a curve.  The cars on the train make a chord, a different geometric concept.  There will always be a gap, fine tuning, precision movement, with real good modern equipment on that track layout you can hold it to three inches.  But Jesus &#8220;bunch of dopes&#8221;, over three weeks and $200,000?</p>
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		<title>By: Niccolo Machiavelli</title>
		<link>http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/01/28/delayed-south-ferry-opening-a-matter-of-inches/#comment-58537</link>
		<dc:creator>Niccolo Machiavelli</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Jan 2009 04:20:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=2123#comment-58537</guid>
		<description>Oh Jason wants the station at City Hall opened.  Beautiful historic property.  Wait until you see the gaps down there.  There was no ADA when that was built.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh Jason wants the station at City Hall opened.  Beautiful historic property.  Wait until you see the gaps down there.  There was no ADA when that was built.</p>
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		<title>By: Simon</title>
		<link>http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/01/28/delayed-south-ferry-opening-a-matter-of-inches/#comment-58533</link>
		<dc:creator>Simon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Jan 2009 02:01:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=2123#comment-58533</guid>
		<description>Those guys at MTA are just a bunch of dopes to actually allow this type of crap to happen. Ultimately they are definately responsible... it goes to show that a lot of things nowadays are just NOT being done like in the good ol&#039; days- with integrity versus passing the buck as many do today. 

There is so much corruption, deceipt and &quot;it&#039;s-not-my-job mentality&quot; among many organizations across the board; and that&#039;s one of the main reasons why our economy is in such bad shape today. The same attitidue permeates our entire society.... so we shouldn&#039;t be surprised that people are now producing at the same capacity as workers in Third World nations like Ecuador- slackers! Nobody gives.....

Perhaps whosoever is responsible should just simply- hang, the way they used to do it ages ago, in places like Rome or in the Middle Ages across Europe. I know, I know... that won&#039;t get the project fixed any faster, but at least that way, in the past when heads rolled (literally) those &quot;bad&quot; genes were kept out of the &quot;good&quot; gene pool, and ensured our species&#039; overall EVOLUTION.

Besides, we&#039;ve got too many people draining the planet anyway.... LOL</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Those guys at MTA are just a bunch of dopes to actually allow this type of crap to happen. Ultimately they are definately responsible&#8230; it goes to show that a lot of things nowadays are just NOT being done like in the good ol&#8217; days- with integrity versus passing the buck as many do today. </p>
<p>There is so much corruption, deceipt and &#8220;it&#8217;s-not-my-job mentality&#8221; among many organizations across the board; and that&#8217;s one of the main reasons why our economy is in such bad shape today. The same attitidue permeates our entire society&#8230;. so we shouldn&#8217;t be surprised that people are now producing at the same capacity as workers in Third World nations like Ecuador- slackers! Nobody gives&#8230;..</p>
<p>Perhaps whosoever is responsible should just simply- hang, the way they used to do it ages ago, in places like Rome or in the Middle Ages across Europe. I know, I know&#8230; that won&#8217;t get the project fixed any faster, but at least that way, in the past when heads rolled (literally) those &#8220;bad&#8221; genes were kept out of the &#8220;good&#8221; gene pool, and ensured our species&#8217; overall EVOLUTION.</p>
<p>Besides, we&#8217;ve got too many people draining the planet anyway&#8230;. LOL</p>
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		<title>By: Josh Karpoff</title>
		<link>http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/01/28/delayed-south-ferry-opening-a-matter-of-inches/#comment-58530</link>
		<dc:creator>Josh Karpoff</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Jan 2009 20:41:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=2123#comment-58530</guid>
		<description>All large construction projects have delays, unexpected costs, contractor errors and design errors. What seperates a good project from a bad project is the project management. I work as an electrical designer for the State of New York and I deal with similar issues all the time.

1) Was this gap screw up a contractor error, a design error or a combination of both? What sort of post project debriefing will be held to draw out the lessons of the project so that they can be applied to future projects?

2) Are MTA contractors working under positive incentives, like completion bonuses and negative incentives like liquidated damges per day past the completion date?

3) The MTA now has enough &quot;mega projects&quot; underway, that it should be able to create a more realistic formula for predicting cost overun percentages and schedule overruns.

4) Does MTA Capital Construction have an Engineer in Charge/ Project Manager/ Construction Superintendent on site at all times there looking out for the MTA&#039;s best interests?

5) What sort of independent review of the design documents does the MTA perform? Is there a detailed and thorough review by qualified design personel not directly involved in the actual design to provide a sanity check for the design?

6) In regard to the gap issue, why can&#039;t they just shim out the existing rubbing boards with something that doesn&#039;t have to be custom made. Like stick some medium density fiberboard, plate steel, or a couple of washers in there and be done with it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>All large construction projects have delays, unexpected costs, contractor errors and design errors. What seperates a good project from a bad project is the project management. I work as an electrical designer for the State of New York and I deal with similar issues all the time.</p>
<p>1) Was this gap screw up a contractor error, a design error or a combination of both? What sort of post project debriefing will be held to draw out the lessons of the project so that they can be applied to future projects?</p>
<p>2) Are MTA contractors working under positive incentives, like completion bonuses and negative incentives like liquidated damges per day past the completion date?</p>
<p>3) The MTA now has enough &#8220;mega projects&#8221; underway, that it should be able to create a more realistic formula for predicting cost overun percentages and schedule overruns.</p>
<p>4) Does MTA Capital Construction have an Engineer in Charge/ Project Manager/ Construction Superintendent on site at all times there looking out for the MTA&#8217;s best interests?</p>
<p>5) What sort of independent review of the design documents does the MTA perform? Is there a detailed and thorough review by qualified design personel not directly involved in the actual design to provide a sanity check for the design?</p>
<p>6) In regard to the gap issue, why can&#8217;t they just shim out the existing rubbing boards with something that doesn&#8217;t have to be custom made. Like stick some medium density fiberboard, plate steel, or a couple of washers in there and be done with it.</p>
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		<title>By: Second Ave. Sagas &#124; A New York City Subway Blog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; &#187; The South Ferry debacle as an MTA metaphor</title>
		<link>http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/01/28/delayed-south-ferry-opening-a-matter-of-inches/#comment-58526</link>
		<dc:creator>Second Ave. Sagas &#124; A New York City Subway Blog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; &#187; The South Ferry debacle as an MTA metaphor</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Jan 2009 06:45:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=2123#comment-58526</guid>
		<description>[...] not a stretch to say that the South Ferry story — the first new station in 20 years delayed by a one-inch miscalculation — is indicative of the larger problems plaguing the MTA. After all, like every other recent [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] not a stretch to say that the South Ferry story — the first new station in 20 years delayed by a one-inch miscalculation — is indicative of the larger problems plaguing the MTA. After all, like every other recent [...]</p>
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		<title>By: herenthere</title>
		<link>http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/01/28/delayed-south-ferry-opening-a-matter-of-inches/#comment-58521</link>
		<dc:creator>herenthere</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Jan 2009 03:21:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=2123#comment-58521</guid>
		<description>Wow, $500 million project and no contractor or engineer even bothered to check the width &lt;i&gt;during&lt;/i&gt; construction. This replacement should take another 2 weeks...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wow, $500 million project and no contractor or engineer even bothered to check the width <i>during</i> construction. This replacement should take another 2 weeks&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Marc Shepherd</title>
		<link>http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/01/28/delayed-south-ferry-opening-a-matter-of-inches/#comment-58518</link>
		<dc:creator>Marc Shepherd</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jan 2009 22:15:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=2123#comment-58518</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t mind the closed stations like 91st and City Hall: they closed for good reasons. But the Els were a tremendous loss of mass-transit capacity, plus the South Ferry shuttle, the Culver Shuttle, etc. On top of that, the mainline rails lost stations and route-miles in Brooklyn, Queens and the Bronx.

There were sound reasons for closing down the Els, but new subway lines were supposed to replace them—and to date those lines have not been built.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t mind the closed stations like 91st and City Hall: they closed for good reasons. But the Els were a tremendous loss of mass-transit capacity, plus the South Ferry shuttle, the Culver Shuttle, etc. On top of that, the mainline rails lost stations and route-miles in Brooklyn, Queens and the Bronx.</p>
<p>There were sound reasons for closing down the Els, but new subway lines were supposed to replace them—and to date those lines have not been built.</p>
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		<title>By: rhywun</title>
		<link>http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/01/28/delayed-south-ferry-opening-a-matter-of-inches/#comment-58517</link>
		<dc:creator>rhywun</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jan 2009 21:30:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=2123#comment-58517</guid>
		<description>I am thinking of all the els that were torn down. The Third Avenue el would have come in handy the last couple decades. I am not familiar with the Bronx so I can&#039;t say if the portion that went through the Bronx (and was torn down in the 70s) was &quot;needed&quot; or not (actually I have a hard time believing that a line through the center of the Bronx would have low ridership, not to mention all the els in central Brooklyn that were torn down). I suspect instead that they just let them deteriorate to the point where it was &quot;cheaper&quot; to tear them down.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am thinking of all the els that were torn down. The Third Avenue el would have come in handy the last couple decades. I am not familiar with the Bronx so I can&#8217;t say if the portion that went through the Bronx (and was torn down in the 70s) was &#8220;needed&#8221; or not (actually I have a hard time believing that a line through the center of the Bronx would have low ridership, not to mention all the els in central Brooklyn that were torn down). I suspect instead that they just let them deteriorate to the point where it was &#8220;cheaper&#8221; to tear them down.</p>
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