Comments on: Bus tracking project killed for the second time http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/01/30/bus-tracking-project-killed-for-the-second-time/ A New York City Subway Blog Sun, 21 Mar 2010 05:18:33 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9 hourly 1 By: Carlos http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/01/30/bus-tracking-project-killed-for-the-second-time/#comment-66328 Carlos Sun, 01 Nov 2009 21:33:04 +0000 http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=2136#comment-66328 The efforts have nothing to do with the problems with electronic tracking of the buses, at the very least here in Brooklyn. What the bus drivers do here to keep on time, when they have either gone off to the bank or gone to eat or chatted with someone, or taken a longer smoke break than needed, they put up the NEXT BUS PLEASE or NOT IN SERVICE signs and then skip a lot of stops to put themselves on time. Here in Greenpoint, there have been some who take the number of the bus and the route number and tried to complaint. So what do the bus drivers do to foil that? They go to the end of the line and then when they pull out, they take back streets or avenues where they can travel fast and not be reported because no one is waiting for a bus on those streets and therefore report them for that. A GPS system would mess up their traveling through back streets to go unnoticed when they are late, and then get back on the regular route when they have caught up, leaving a lot of straphangers waiting on the street. That would be a political and union embarrassment and its not surprising that they have been trying to cover that up The efforts have nothing to do with the problems with electronic tracking of the buses, at the very least here in Brooklyn. What the bus drivers do here to keep on time, when they have either gone off to the bank or gone to eat or chatted with someone, or taken a longer smoke break than needed, they put up the NEXT BUS PLEASE or NOT IN SERVICE signs and then skip a lot of stops to put themselves on time. Here in Greenpoint, there have been some who take the number of the bus and the route number and tried to complaint. So what do the bus drivers do to foil that? They go to the end of the line and then when they pull out, they take back streets or avenues where they can travel fast and not be reported because no one is waiting for a bus on those streets and therefore report them for that. A GPS system would mess up their traveling through back streets to go unnoticed when they are late, and then get back on the regular route when they have caught up, leaving a lot of straphangers waiting on the street. That would be a political and union embarrassment and its not surprising that they have been trying to cover that up

]]> By: Take Three: Bus arrival boards debut along 34th St. :: Second Ave. Sagas | A New York City Subway Blog http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/01/30/bus-tracking-project-killed-for-the-second-time/#comment-63448 Take Three: Bus arrival boards debut along 34th St. :: Second Ave. Sagas | A New York City Subway Blog Tue, 11 Aug 2009 17:50:25 +0000 http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=2136#comment-63448 [...] the world online in New York. In March, I eulogized the bus tracking plan as the MTA killed it for the second time. Now, though, agency and city officials claim they have found the winning combination. So will the [...] [...] the world online in New York. In March, I eulogized the bus tracking plan as the MTA killed it for the second time. Now, though, agency and city officials claim they have found the winning combination. So will the [...]

]]> By: jean http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/01/30/bus-tracking-project-killed-for-the-second-time/#comment-60210 jean Sun, 19 Apr 2009 14:44:37 +0000 http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=2136#comment-60210 Why can;t it be done in a city like New-York, that's incredible?? Anyway, as far as france is concerned, they started implementing a real time bus tracking system, where you can track on the internet and through a vocal server your bus and its approximated time of arrival. The sytem is based on GPS. So why not enquiring to the company that developped the system to build it in New-York, or ask their counter part in London? Here's the link to the article: http://www.veolia-transport.com/en/serving-passengers/informing.aspx Why can;t it be done in a city like New-York, that’s incredible??
Anyway, as far as france is concerned, they started implementing a real time bus tracking system, where you can track on the internet and through a vocal server your bus and its approximated time of arrival.
The sytem is based on GPS.
So why not enquiring to the company that developped the system to build it in New-York, or ask their counter part in London?
Here’s the link to the article:
http://www.veolia-transport.co.....rming.aspx

]]> By: An elegy for the bus-tracking project :: Second Ave. Sagas | A New York City Subway Blog http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/01/30/bus-tracking-project-killed-for-the-second-time/#comment-59044 An elegy for the bus-tracking project :: Second Ave. Sagas | A New York City Subway Blog Mon, 02 Mar 2009 05:02:14 +0000 http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=2136#comment-59044 [...] latest effort to implement a system that would alert riders of the time until the next bus came to a crashing halt at the end of January. At the time, MTA officials told the City Council that the tracking times for [...] [...] latest effort to implement a system that would alert riders of the time until the next bus came to a crashing halt at the end of January. At the time, MTA officials told the City Council that the tracking times for [...]

]]> By: commutertech http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/01/30/bus-tracking-project-killed-for-the-second-time/#comment-58866 commutertech Sat, 21 Feb 2009 17:23:04 +0000 http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=2136#comment-58866 A few facts: 1. The problem for the NYCT Bus AVL (automatic vehicle location) system wasn't the accuracy of the locations. The system uses beside GPS also dead reckoning information (turn rate sensor + odometer) and the street map (mapmatching). The location accuracy was pretty good. 2. The company that delivered the system is THE SAME as delivered the system for TfL (Transport for London). London's offcials are very happy with the overall system (which serves by the way approx. 9'000 Buses!!!). 3. The problem is simple incompetent people on the NYCT side - e.g. former bus drivers managing a multi-million dollar contract - isn't that unbelievable? And believe me - I've spoken to insiders. Good night New Yorkmapmatching) A few facts:

1. The problem for the NYCT Bus AVL (automatic vehicle location) system wasn’t the accuracy of the locations. The system uses beside GPS also dead reckoning information (turn rate sensor + odometer) and the street map (mapmatching). The location accuracy was pretty good.

2. The company that delivered the system is THE SAME as delivered the system for TfL (Transport for London). London’s offcials are very happy with the overall system (which serves by the way approx. 9′000 Buses!!!).

3. The problem is simple incompetent people on the NYCT side – e.g. former bus drivers managing a multi-million dollar contract – isn’t that unbelievable?

And believe me – I’ve spoken to insiders.

Good night New Yorkmapmatching)

]]> By: Dave http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/01/30/bus-tracking-project-killed-for-the-second-time/#comment-58689 Dave Sun, 08 Feb 2009 19:15:04 +0000 http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=2136#comment-58689 NYC was also late to get Enhanced 911 - the ability to know where callers are calling from when they dial 9-1-1. It's a daunting paradox that a lead society is the least adaptive to new technology. But that's how it is. It's very difficult to retrofit new things into the core and mantle of stuff that was built up decades ago when nobody could have imagined such things as GPS. Many cities introducing all this neat stuff have relatively smaller transit budgets and smaller operating scope. It's just easier to figure out. Coming from a transit-poor part of the country prior to this, however, I will say that the density and headway of trains and buses does not *quite* make knowing where everything is at a given moment the same handy idea it might be in, say, Austin Texas. To be honest, and I realize I say this as a new resident, I haven't had to uncomfortably wait for a bus or train all that long at any time yet. There's always a bus or train "next" in 10 minutes when I want one, with few exceptions. I don't even think of schedules here in NYC, I just show up and wait - and everything takes care of itself. I'd still like to see live tracking though, don't get me wrong. It's a sort of "universal enhancement" no matter where it's used, and I'm shocked the best anyone can do after all this is shrug and give up. - D NYC was also late to get Enhanced 911 – the ability to know where callers are calling from when they dial 9-1-1. It’s a daunting paradox that a lead society is the least adaptive to new technology. But that’s how it is. It’s very difficult to retrofit new things into the core and mantle of stuff that was built up decades ago when nobody could have imagined such things as GPS.

Many cities introducing all this neat stuff have relatively smaller transit budgets and smaller operating scope. It’s just easier to figure out.

Coming from a transit-poor part of the country prior to this, however, I will say that the density and headway of trains and buses does not *quite* make knowing where everything is at a given moment the same handy idea it might be in, say, Austin Texas. To be honest, and I realize I say this as a new resident, I haven’t had to uncomfortably wait for a bus or train all that long at any time yet. There’s always a bus or train “next” in 10 minutes when I want one, with few exceptions. I don’t even think of schedules here in NYC, I just show up and wait – and everything takes care of itself.

I’d still like to see live tracking though, don’t get me wrong. It’s a sort of “universal enhancement” no matter where it’s used, and I’m shocked the best anyone can do after all this is shrug and give up.

- D

]]> By: dfssfd http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/01/30/bus-tracking-project-killed-for-the-second-time/#comment-58656 dfssfd Fri, 06 Feb 2009 05:07:07 +0000 http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=2136#comment-58656 They have the same system in Paris. It is very convenient. It is even possible to see on your cell phone and internet were the bus is. You can see a picture here : http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fichier:SIEL_-_Lignes_42_et_88.JPG They have that also on metro platforms. It is a shame that NY doesn't have this. They have the same system in Paris. It is very convenient. It is even possible to see on your cell phone and internet were the bus is.

You can see a picture here : http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/F....._et_88.JPG

They have that also on metro platforms.
It is a shame that NY doesn’t have this.

]]> By: dwight http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/01/30/bus-tracking-project-killed-for-the-second-time/#comment-58644 dwight Thu, 05 Feb 2009 17:08:42 +0000 http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=2136#comment-58644 don't leave technology related decisions up to ill informed city officials and overpriced contractors! i say we involve programs such as ITP (NYU) or SENSEable City (MIT) to brainstorm creative and cheap methods of implementing solutions to these issues. those involved with these programs have a broader knowledge of existing/developing technologies as well as methods of execution. they aren't an end all for these issues but they're a better starting point. don’t leave technology related decisions up to ill informed city officials and overpriced contractors! i say we involve programs such as ITP (NYU) or SENSEable City (MIT) to brainstorm creative and cheap methods of implementing solutions to these issues. those involved with these programs have a broader knowledge of existing/developing technologies as well as methods of execution. they aren’t an end all for these issues but they’re a better starting point.

]]> By: p http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/01/30/bus-tracking-project-killed-for-the-second-time/#comment-58618 p Wed, 04 Feb 2009 00:13:55 +0000 http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=2136#comment-58618 GPS? Who needs GPS? What, your buying from Best Buy? Each bus stop will need electronics, put a radio transmitter on each bus stop, use triangulation, end of story. If bus not in range of radio transmitter of current bus stop, look up where the bus is over the network/data backhaul from a bus stop that does know where the bus is. Simple as pie. GPS? Who needs GPS? What, your buying from Best Buy?

Each bus stop will need electronics, put a radio transmitter on each bus stop, use triangulation, end of story. If bus not in range of radio transmitter of current bus stop, look up where the bus is over the network/data backhaul from a bus stop that does know where the bus is. Simple as pie.

]]> By: MAL http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/01/30/bus-tracking-project-killed-for-the-second-time/#comment-58610 MAL Tue, 03 Feb 2009 21:17:30 +0000 http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=2136#comment-58610 Buses aside, what about the digital apparatuses they have set up in all sorts of stations (110th St. on the 1 comes to mind)? Have any of those started working yet, and if so, are they identical to those used on the L? Buses aside, what about the digital apparatuses they have set up in all sorts of stations (110th St. on the 1 comes to mind)? Have any of those started working yet, and if so, are they identical to those used on the L?

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