Comments on: Scapegoating the SAS delays http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/07/22/scapegoating-the-sas-delays/ A New York City Subway Blog Fri, 25 May 2012 22:48:08 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Nathanael http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/07/22/scapegoating-the-sas-delays/#comment-63017 Nathanael Tue, 28 Jul 2009 09:23:25 +0000 http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=3382#comment-63017 First of all, the only damaged buildings were already structurally unsound; while the MTA really should have checked on such things and had the Department of Buildings condemn them and evict everyone *before* construction started, they aren't going to be liable for one red cent. Second, surface work is going to drop tremendously very soon. I guess there will be some more when they actually start building the entrances, fan buildings, and so forth, but for a while almost all the work will be invisible. Businesses may proceed to cheer. The price? Thanks to the recession, there hasn't been any inflation. Why should the price go up significantly? First of all, the only damaged buildings were already structurally unsound; while the MTA really should have checked on such things and had the Department of Buildings condemn them and evict everyone *before* construction started, they aren’t going to be liable for one red cent.

Second, surface work is going to drop tremendously very soon. I guess there will be some more when they actually start building the entrances, fan buildings, and so forth, but for a while almost all the work will be invisible. Businesses may proceed to cheer.

The price? Thanks to the recession, there hasn’t been any inflation. Why should the price go up significantly?

]]> By: Albany-enforced oversight, but is it what the MTA needs? :: Second Ave. Sagas | A New York City Subway Blog http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/07/22/scapegoating-the-sas-delays/#comment-62909 Albany-enforced oversight, but is it what the MTA needs? :: Second Ave. Sagas | A New York City Subway Blog Wed, 22 Jul 2009 20:57:22 +0000 http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=3382#comment-62909 [...] I mentioned earlier today, the MTA needs to be held accountable for its failures. That public undertaking needs to extend far beyond a rubber stamp for high contracts and a [...] [...] I mentioned earlier today, the MTA needs to be held accountable for its failures. That public undertaking needs to extend far beyond a rubber stamp for high contracts and a [...]

]]> By: peter knox http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/07/22/scapegoating-the-sas-delays/#comment-62908 peter knox Wed, 22 Jul 2009 20:49:12 +0000 http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=3382#comment-62908 Using a little common sense, I warned NYC back in 2007 that this project was a fiasco. It was never going to be completed in less than ten years at best. Now the MTA has been forced by the troublesome thing called "reality" to tell more of the truth about its ludicrous timetable for this project. But, of course, they keep telling whopping lines, and, of course, Kabak and the visitors to his pointless site, who are more interested in how to squeeze every dime out of their Metrocards, are being duped again. Everyone laments the 2017 completion date, but what about the inexcusable falsehood contained in the "only a hundred million more" price tag. Back in 2001, the MTA priced the SAS at 3.9B. Now, eight years later, with the completion pushed back at leasts five or six years, they claim the price has only gone up six or seven hundred million. Think, people! That can simply not be true. Even if they hadn't destroyed two buildings between 92nd and 93rd St, and made themselves vulnerable to lawsuits in the hundreds of millions, the price would still have to be around 5.5 to 6 billion. I could go on and on, but what is the point? Nobody seems to care that businesses are being destroyed, apartments are being destroyed, the lives of the many elderly in the area have been destroyed. No, all that matters is that Kabak can take a ride in 2020 from Brooklyn to the Upper East Side. Great. But it is shameful that nobody out there has a brain or a heart. Using a little common sense, I warned NYC back in 2007 that this project was a fiasco. It was never going to be completed in less than ten years at best. Now the MTA has been forced by the troublesome thing called “reality” to tell more of the truth about its ludicrous timetable for this project. But, of course, they keep telling whopping lines, and, of course, Kabak and the visitors to his pointless site, who are more interested in how to squeeze every dime out of their Metrocards, are being duped again. Everyone laments the 2017 completion date, but what about the inexcusable falsehood contained in the “only a hundred million more” price tag. Back in 2001, the MTA priced the SAS at 3.9B. Now, eight years later, with the completion pushed back at leasts five or six years, they claim the price has only gone up six or seven hundred million. Think, people! That can simply not be true. Even if they hadn’t destroyed two buildings between 92nd and 93rd St, and made themselves vulnerable to lawsuits in the hundreds of millions, the price would still have to be around 5.5 to 6 billion. I could go on and on, but what is the point? Nobody seems to care that businesses are being destroyed, apartments are being destroyed, the lives of the many elderly in the area have been destroyed. No, all that matters is that Kabak can take a ride in 2020 from Brooklyn to the Upper East Side. Great. But it is shameful that nobody out there has a brain or a heart.

]]> By: Eric http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/07/22/scapegoating-the-sas-delays/#comment-62907 Eric Wed, 22 Jul 2009 18:01:08 +0000 http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=3382#comment-62907 Thank you, Sir! Thank you, Sir!

]]> By: The Daily Dig - ‘Plants Are Infrastructure Too’ Edition » INFRASTRUCTURIST http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/07/22/scapegoating-the-sas-delays/#comment-62904 The Daily Dig - ‘Plants Are Infrastructure Too’ Edition » INFRASTRUCTURIST Wed, 22 Jul 2009 17:08:01 +0000 http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=3382#comment-62904 [...] New Yorkers, who have been hearing about the Second Ave subway since the Kennedy administration, will now get to savor the suspense for a while longer, as the MTA is pushing back the completion date for phase one to late 2016 (or maybe 2017). But what’s a year or two among friends? (NYT and Second Ave Sagas) [...] [...] New Yorkers, who have been hearing about the Second Ave subway since the Kennedy administration, will now get to savor the suspense for a while longer, as the MTA is pushing back the completion date for phase one to late 2016 (or maybe 2017). But what’s a year or two among friends? (NYT and Second Ave Sagas) [...]

]]> By: Benjamin Kabak http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/07/22/scapegoating-the-sas-delays/#comment-62902 Benjamin Kabak Wed, 22 Jul 2009 16:44:26 +0000 http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=3382#comment-62902 They are currently digging on the Upper East Side in the 90s, but Phase I isn't a subway line in isolation. It's going to be from 57th St. and Broadway northeast under the park to 63rd and then up Second Ave. to 96th. They started digging on the UES because it's easier to drop the heavy machinery in on the UES than it would be in Midtown. It would have been far more disruptive to current service on the N/Q/R/W as well to start digging at the southern connector. In the end, it doesn't really matter where the digging starts though. Before the line can open they have to connect down to the Q at 57th and wouldn't have opened it before reaching 96th St. had they dug north from 57th St. They are currently digging on the Upper East Side in the 90s, but Phase I isn’t a subway line in isolation. It’s going to be from 57th St. and Broadway northeast under the park to 63rd and then up Second Ave. to 96th. They started digging on the UES because it’s easier to drop the heavy machinery in on the UES than it would be in Midtown. It would have been far more disruptive to current service on the N/Q/R/W as well to start digging at the southern connector.

In the end, it doesn’t really matter where the digging starts though. Before the line can open they have to connect down to the Q at 57th and wouldn’t have opened it before reaching 96th St. had they dug north from 57th St.

]]> By: Eric http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/07/22/scapegoating-the-sas-delays/#comment-62901 Eric Wed, 22 Jul 2009 16:40:44 +0000 http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=3382#comment-62901 Marc, I might be very wrong in my thoughts of where the SAS construction is taking place. I thought 2nd Ave in the 90s was being dug up. With the Q in the high 50s, I don't see how that's close. Perhaps my mirrored vision problems got the best of me once again and that they are digging up the 60s? Marc, I might be very wrong in my thoughts of where the SAS construction is taking place. I thought 2nd Ave in the 90s was being dug up. With the Q in the high 50s, I don’t see how that’s close.

Perhaps my mirrored vision problems got the best of me once again and that they are digging up the 60s?

]]> By: Marc Shepherd http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/07/22/scapegoating-the-sas-delays/#comment-62899 Marc Shepherd Wed, 22 Jul 2009 15:17:29 +0000 http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=3382#comment-62899 <em>Ben, I know it’s too late to have redo the project from the start, but this newest delay makes me scratch my head and wonder why they didn’t start the SAS from where it would meet/connect with already established lines.</em> Perhaps I am not understanding the question. That's precisely where they <em>are</em> starting it—namely, where it can connect to the Q. There is literally no other starting point that even comes close to making sense, because there's nowhere else that it could connect to anything. The most clotted part of the Lex is between 96th Street and 42nd Street, which is precisely the area that Phase I of the SAS will serve. Ben, I know it’s too late to have redo the project from the start, but this newest delay makes me scratch my head and wonder why they didn’t start the SAS from where it would meet/connect with already established lines.

Perhaps I am not understanding the question. That’s precisely where they are starting it—namely, where it can connect to the Q. There is literally no other starting point that even comes close to making sense, because there’s nowhere else that it could connect to anything. The most clotted part of the Lex is between 96th Street and 42nd Street, which is precisely the area that Phase I of the SAS will serve.

]]> By: A. Fine http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/07/22/scapegoating-the-sas-delays/#comment-62898 A. Fine Wed, 22 Jul 2009 15:14:00 +0000 http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=3382#comment-62898 P.S. Keep up the great work Ben! P.S. Keep up the great work Ben!

]]> By: A. Fine http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/07/22/scapegoating-the-sas-delays/#comment-62897 A. Fine Wed, 22 Jul 2009 15:13:04 +0000 http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=3382#comment-62897 From day one, this subway was 7 years away, and 4 years later, the subway is 7 years away. What is wrong with this picture? Second Avenue merchants are screwed for years to come and the community suffers from retail that is saying bye-bye. This should have been a quick dig and cover operation. 3 quarters of our subway system was built in less than a decade, but it takes 12 years for 30 blocks of subways because everyone is milking this for all it's worth. Utter bullshit. From day one, this subway was 7 years away, and 4 years later, the subway is 7 years away. What is wrong with this picture?
Second Avenue merchants are screwed for years to come and the community suffers from retail that is saying bye-bye. This should have been a quick dig and cover operation. 3 quarters of our subway system was built in less than a decade, but it takes 12 years for 30 blocks of subways because everyone is milking this for all it’s worth. Utter bullshit.

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