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	<title>Comments on: A capital investment, but in what?</title>
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	<link>http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/08/26/a-capital-investment-but-in-what/</link>
	<description>A New York City Subway Blog</description>
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		<title>By: Andrew</title>
		<link>http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/08/26/a-capital-investment-but-in-what/#comment-64213</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 30 Aug 2009 02:14:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=3745#comment-64213</guid>
		<description>There is no possible way that this proposed express run would cut a 50-minute trip by 15 minutes, despite the RPA&#039;s dreams.  Sorry.

For the people who currently ride the line, service would be substantially worse (less frequent, more crowded, and prone to merging delays with the express).  And I doubt the express would attract many new riders.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There is no possible way that this proposed express run would cut a 50-minute trip by 15 minutes, despite the RPA&#8217;s dreams.  Sorry.</p>
<p>For the people who currently ride the line, service would be substantially worse (less frequent, more crowded, and prone to merging delays with the express).  And I doubt the express would attract many new riders.</p>
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		<title>By: AlexB</title>
		<link>http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/08/26/a-capital-investment-but-in-what/#comment-64181</link>
		<dc:creator>AlexB</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 28 Aug 2009 15:27:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=3745#comment-64181</guid>
		<description>I was referring to &quot;Tomorrow&#039;s Transit&quot; that the RPA put out a while ago, which I hope someone at the MTA has to read.  They recommended a third track on the J line as a cheap, short term way to improve transit to downtown.  Supposedly, a large portion of it east of Cypress Hills was built to accomodate a third track, which could be built relatively cheaply because of this foresight.  

The area from Cypress Hills to Bway Junction was only built for two tracks.  Bway Junction to Marcy already has three tracks.  Supposedly, if you run some J trains express, and they skip some of the stops along the two track portion, you can make it from Jamaica to Fulton st in 9 stops and 35 minutes, a bit faster than the LIRR to downtown Brooklyn + transfer to the subway.  The eastern Queens to downtown commuters would be the obvious beneficiaries of this new route, but there would be benefits to anyone traveling to Chinatown, the LES, Williamsburg, etc from Queens.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was referring to &#8220;Tomorrow&#8217;s Transit&#8221; that the RPA put out a while ago, which I hope someone at the MTA has to read.  They recommended a third track on the J line as a cheap, short term way to improve transit to downtown.  Supposedly, a large portion of it east of Cypress Hills was built to accomodate a third track, which could be built relatively cheaply because of this foresight.  </p>
<p>The area from Cypress Hills to Bway Junction was only built for two tracks.  Bway Junction to Marcy already has three tracks.  Supposedly, if you run some J trains express, and they skip some of the stops along the two track portion, you can make it from Jamaica to Fulton st in 9 stops and 35 minutes, a bit faster than the LIRR to downtown Brooklyn + transfer to the subway.  The eastern Queens to downtown commuters would be the obvious beneficiaries of this new route, but there would be benefits to anyone traveling to Chinatown, the LES, Williamsburg, etc from Queens.</p>
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		<title>By: Andrew</title>
		<link>http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/08/26/a-capital-investment-but-in-what/#comment-64166</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 28 Aug 2009 02:21:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=3745#comment-64166</guid>
		<description>Obviously, E passengers bound for Midtown wouldn&#039;t use the J/Z.  But E passengers bound for Lower Manhattan - and there are many (either they stay on the E all the way down or they transfer to the 6 and then to the 4/5) - might be more inclined to shift to the J/Z if there were an express.

I&#039;m not sure what you&#039;re getting at with the L.  The busiest part of the line is west of the transfer points to the J/Z and the M.  And the transfer point to the J/Z also happens to be the transfer point to the A/C, which is a faster route to Lower Manhattan than the J/Z (and possibly even a faster route to Midtown than the L - I&#039;m not sure).  Somebody commuting to Manhattan from, say, Montrose Avenue is going to take the L into Manhattan and transfer there, if necessary, to the appropriate north-south line.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Obviously, E passengers bound for Midtown wouldn&#8217;t use the J/Z.  But E passengers bound for Lower Manhattan &#8211; and there are many (either they stay on the E all the way down or they transfer to the 6 and then to the 4/5) &#8211; might be more inclined to shift to the J/Z if there were an express.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m not sure what you&#8217;re getting at with the L.  The busiest part of the line is west of the transfer points to the J/Z and the M.  And the transfer point to the J/Z also happens to be the transfer point to the A/C, which is a faster route to Lower Manhattan than the J/Z (and possibly even a faster route to Midtown than the L &#8211; I&#8217;m not sure).  Somebody commuting to Manhattan from, say, Montrose Avenue is going to take the L into Manhattan and transfer there, if necessary, to the appropriate north-south line.</p>
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		<title>By: Alon Levy</title>
		<link>http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/08/26/a-capital-investment-but-in-what/#comment-64157</link>
		<dc:creator>Alon Levy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Aug 2009 14:16:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=3745#comment-64157</guid>
		<description>More importantly, the J/M/Z goes to Lower Manhattan, a smaller business district than Midtown. That&#039;s why it doesn&#039;t relieve congestion on the L, either.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>More importantly, the J/M/Z goes to Lower Manhattan, a smaller business district than Midtown. That&#8217;s why it doesn&#8217;t relieve congestion on the L, either.</p>
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		<title>By: Streetsblog New York City &#187; Today&#8217;s Headlines</title>
		<link>http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/08/26/a-capital-investment-but-in-what/#comment-64155</link>
		<dc:creator>Streetsblog New York City &#187; Today&#8217;s Headlines</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Aug 2009 13:20:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=3745#comment-64155</guid>
		<description>[...] Will Albany Fund the MTA Enough to Maintain and Expand Our Transit System? (News, 2nd Ave Sagas) [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Will Albany Fund the MTA Enough to Maintain and Expand Our Transit System? (News, 2nd Ave Sagas) [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Andrew</title>
		<link>http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/08/26/a-capital-investment-but-in-what/#comment-64146</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Aug 2009 01:01:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=3745#comment-64146</guid>
		<description>One could argue that operating a Jamaica express - which would require a third track - would relieve pressure on the Queens Boulevard line, and the E in particular.

Mind you, &lt;i&gt;I&#039;m&lt;/i&gt; not making that argument - personally, I doubt it would have much of an impact on the E.  And it would be quite expensive, as the island platforms along Fulton Street would all need to be relocated.  Also, there are two all-stop (J/Z) stations along that stretch - Woodhaven Boulevard and Cypress Hills.  They&#039;d need to be configured as express stations in order to provide them with adequate service and not to overload the local.  Come to think of it, even with those two stations as express stations, the locals would still probably be more crowded than the expresses.

But I could be wrong.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>One could argue that operating a Jamaica express &#8211; which would require a third track &#8211; would relieve pressure on the Queens Boulevard line, and the E in particular.</p>
<p>Mind you, <i>I&#8217;m</i> not making that argument &#8211; personally, I doubt it would have much of an impact on the E.  And it would be quite expensive, as the island platforms along Fulton Street would all need to be relocated.  Also, there are two all-stop (J/Z) stations along that stretch &#8211; Woodhaven Boulevard and Cypress Hills.  They&#8217;d need to be configured as express stations in order to provide them with adequate service and not to overload the local.  Come to think of it, even with those two stations as express stations, the locals would still probably be more crowded than the expresses.</p>
<p>But I could be wrong.</p>
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		<title>By: Jerrold</title>
		<link>http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/08/26/a-capital-investment-but-in-what/#comment-64144</link>
		<dc:creator>Jerrold</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Aug 2009 00:11:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=3745#comment-64144</guid>
		<description>The #7 Line extension would NOT be so silly if they had kept the 10th Ave./41st St. station in the plans.  Even if that meant taking a few more years to build it at the level of annual funding available, that&#039;s what should have been done.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The #7 Line extension would NOT be so silly if they had kept the 10th Ave./41st St. station in the plans.  Even if that meant taking a few more years to build it at the level of annual funding available, that&#8217;s what should have been done.</p>
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		<title>By: Noah</title>
		<link>http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/08/26/a-capital-investment-but-in-what/#comment-64139</link>
		<dc:creator>Noah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Aug 2009 21:04:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=3745#comment-64139</guid>
		<description>First the Q terminates at 57th.

Well I think the real problem is American culture. This is the same problem we have with health care that most developed countries don&#039;t have. In our culture we live by the golden rule &quot;If it aint broke, don&#039;t fix it&quot;. Essentially we have no concept of real maintenance, now yes for the NYC subway system we have a major problem, as it runs 24x7 it is hard to ever find times to do regular maintenance. It&#039;s cheaper to keep things in working order than repairing things that are broken. If we switched to the idea of preventative maintenance we would be able to have more funds available to actually expand the system. Currently the development in the system that does exist is too Manhattan centric and projects like the Second Ave projects shouldn&#039;t be considered a mega project. A mega project would be filling in all of the wholes in the system where there is no reliable transportation other than buses.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>First the Q terminates at 57th.</p>
<p>Well I think the real problem is American culture. This is the same problem we have with health care that most developed countries don&#8217;t have. In our culture we live by the golden rule &#8220;If it aint broke, don&#8217;t fix it&#8221;. Essentially we have no concept of real maintenance, now yes for the NYC subway system we have a major problem, as it runs 24&#215;7 it is hard to ever find times to do regular maintenance. It&#8217;s cheaper to keep things in working order than repairing things that are broken. If we switched to the idea of preventative maintenance we would be able to have more funds available to actually expand the system. Currently the development in the system that does exist is too Manhattan centric and projects like the Second Ave projects shouldn&#8217;t be considered a mega project. A mega project would be filling in all of the wholes in the system where there is no reliable transportation other than buses.</p>
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		<title>By: Woody</title>
		<link>http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/08/26/a-capital-investment-but-in-what/#comment-64137</link>
		<dc:creator>Woody</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Aug 2009 19:29:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=3745#comment-64137</guid>
		<description>If federal transit funding were adequate, we wouldn&#039;t be in this awful bind. Unfortunately, there isn&#039;t enough money in the transit pot. And the feds dole it out with an effective cap of &quot;not so much to any one project that it takes all the money&quot; that brings the federal share of our projects down to 25% or 35% or so.

The NYC area has three huge projects -- the Second Avenue Subway, the East Side Access, the Jersey Transit thing, Journey to the Earth&#039;s Core or what&#039;s it called. (Not to mention the #7 extension and assorted other smaller projects.) And so each of these three megaprojects has a federal share that works out at far less than half the cost of building them. If the feds were paying 50%, or better 60%, or best the 80% of 90% they do for highway stuff, then the MTA, the City of New York, the State of New York, and the Port Authority of NY and NJ would have much more money to put behind other projects, even repair and maintenance.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If federal transit funding were adequate, we wouldn&#8217;t be in this awful bind. Unfortunately, there isn&#8217;t enough money in the transit pot. And the feds dole it out with an effective cap of &#8220;not so much to any one project that it takes all the money&#8221; that brings the federal share of our projects down to 25% or 35% or so.</p>
<p>The NYC area has three huge projects &#8212; the Second Avenue Subway, the East Side Access, the Jersey Transit thing, Journey to the Earth&#8217;s Core or what&#8217;s it called. (Not to mention the #7 extension and assorted other smaller projects.) And so each of these three megaprojects has a federal share that works out at far less than half the cost of building them. If the feds were paying 50%, or better 60%, or best the 80% of 90% they do for highway stuff, then the MTA, the City of New York, the State of New York, and the Port Authority of NY and NJ would have much more money to put behind other projects, even repair and maintenance.</p>
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		<title>By: john</title>
		<link>http://secondavenuesagas.com/2009/08/26/a-capital-investment-but-in-what/#comment-64135</link>
		<dc:creator>john</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Aug 2009 17:42:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://secondavenuesagas.com/?p=3745#comment-64135</guid>
		<description>As someone who stands to gain virtually no benefit from the project, I do think the Second Avenue line is absolutely necessary for the upper east side. There just is no more capacity on Lexington Avenue, period, and it&#039;s crazy that that area has gone with only one subway line since the fifties.

That said, I definitely do hope that in a few centuries once they finish it, that they move all the money they would have gone to new contstruction to rebuilding the present system and restoring it entirely to a state of good repair. It seems like if they don&#039;t, the general deterioration of everything will if anything accelerate as the system heads into its second century.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As someone who stands to gain virtually no benefit from the project, I do think the Second Avenue line is absolutely necessary for the upper east side. There just is no more capacity on Lexington Avenue, period, and it&#8217;s crazy that that area has gone with only one subway line since the fifties.</p>
<p>That said, I definitely do hope that in a few centuries once they finish it, that they move all the money they would have gone to new contstruction to rebuilding the present system and restoring it entirely to a state of good repair. It seems like if they don&#8217;t, the general deterioration of everything will if anything accelerate as the system heads into its second century.</p>
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